Rules Questions

[Kar98k]

@Stuart Harrison: Just to confirm, you are saying “Yes” to Jeff Knez’s question? Which was:

“Let’s say I have a Inexperienced transport that has a MMG for a weapon (a German SdKfz 251/1 halftrack for example). When it shoots, it incurs a -1
To Hit penalty due to being inexperienced. Got it.

Now let’s say I have a Veteran infantry squad riding in the transport. Can it shoot the MMG instead so that it doesn’t incur the -1 to Hit penalty?”

I’m not so sure the answer is “Yes”, and here is why: 1) The transport’s MG (MMG or HMG) is fired by the Inexperienced crew and not by the passengers – I will explain. 2) If the transport had additional MGs (usually MMGs), they could be fired by the passengers. However the original question by Jeff Knez was, “I have a Inexperienced transport that has a[sic] MMG for a weapon”, implying the transport has only one MG with no additional MGs added. According to the rules as written, “first declare which weapon is operated by the crew and which are operated by the passengers.” (see page 146). Granted, it would have been a whole lot more clear had it said, “first declare which weapon is operated by the crew and then which are operated by the passengers.”, which is what I think they meant.

[Stuart Harrison]

I am not saying the answer to his question is ‘yes’.

The crew’s penalties apply to the weapon fired by the crew.  The passenger’s penalty applies to weapons fired by the passenger’s.

The passenger’s only come into it after the single weapon permitted to the crew.  They don’t get to take over all the weapons, just the ones that are ‘more than one weapon’ (and yes, that sentence could be worded better if the second edition discussions had been applied to refine it).

[Anthony Miles]

Hopefully a quick question. Do the Army Special Rules in the “Armies of” supplements supersede those in the Main Rule Book or are they additional?

[Kar98k]

Hopefully a quick question. Do the Army Special Rules in the “Armies of” supplements supersede those in the Main Rule Book or are they additional?

Hopefully a quick answer 🙂

It is either one or the other, but not both

Now for a longer response 😉

You and your opponent must decide whether to use the “Army Lists” and their special rules from either the Bolt Action 3E rule book, or the “Armies of…” books. Not both at the same time.

Also note that it’s not just the army special rules that might be different, but some of the units themselves. There are several to note, but here is an easy one; if you look at the American MMG team, you will see a difference. In the Bolt Action rule book (in the Army Lists), the MMG team has an “Extra Selection (MMG only)” special rule, but you do not get this option in the “Armies of the United States” book.

• This reply was modified 3 months ago by Kar98k.

[Stuart Harrison]

The intent is that MRB lists are entirely replaced when the Armies of book is published.  This would include the interim army special rules.

P199, 5th para:

“These provisional Army Lists will be superseded by the relevant Armies of… book when each is published (e.g. the Germany list in this rulebook is replaced by the lists in the Armies of Germany book once released.”

If you don’t have the Armies of… yet, most people have no problem with using the MRB instead for a friendly game.  For an event you would need to check with the event organisers.

[Anthony Miles]

Thanks

[Jim welch]

Light Mortars and the Brutish Paras. Hi The British Para had light mortars down to Section Level. In the rules when talking about teams weapons you hint at more than LMG  being used a section level is this possible? It’s seems This could have been addressed in the  army list. To note these where a Modified weapon used to lay Smoke only. 6 Rounds only  where  carried. To get this to work you need better smoke rules

[Stuart Harrison]

“In the rules when talking about teams weapons you hint at more than LMG  being used a section level is this possible?” – there are multiple units in the game with team weapons other than LMG at section level – examples include light mortars (eg: Japanese grenadier sections,) and flame throwers (engineer sections for multiple nations).

Light mortars are already an option for British Airborne Sections, AoGB p30, fourth option in the list.

[Eric T Holmes]

Can Soviet Platoon Leaders and Company Commanders ride tanks if their platoon is made up of Tank Riders?  Also, can the Light Mortars, and any ancillary Teams ride the tanks, as well?

If the Officer has a Banner assigned to its team, and the officer team is riding on top of a tank, is the banner displayed?  This is dependent on the previous question.

I know this might sound crazy, by the end of the war, almost every country had infantry riding atop tanks.  Wow, what a fast way to get somewhere.

Along those lines, an officer on board a command half track should be able to “Snap To” infantry carried in at least two half tracks (transports).  That would include any carried teams or specialty half tracks … SdKfz 251/8 or M3 Mortar Carrier come to mind.  I know this could be a game changer, but realize each squad leader would be in command of “his” own ride since he’d be in possession of the orders for the day.   (yeah, yeah, yeah … it’s from Tank Wars.)

This kinda stuff might come from some gentlemen that actually rode into the fight, and therefore became Haus Rules.

YMMV

Play the game … and

Roll sixes!

[Eric T Holmes]

Here’s another conundrum concerning MMG armed transports. Except for any internal hull mounted MMGs, passengers had been known to grab the external MMGs and use them for their own fire power.  Think of the German Panzer Grenadiers or the American Armored Infantry units. The guns went with them and their transports pulled away.  (Yeah, yeah, yeah … Another Tank Wars scenario or Haus Rule.)  YMMV

Play the Game!

Roll Sixes!

[Hoff]

What counts as “ending an activation” for claiming objectives?

If I give an Ambush order, does that count?

If I go Down for being shot at, does that count?

If giving an Ambush order doesn’t count…does converting it to a Fire or Down order count?

If giving an Ambush order counts…does starting the game in Ambush count?

• This reply was modified 2 weeks, 1 day ago by Hoff. Reason: spelling

[Kar98k]

@Hoff – good questions, but nothing to loose sleep over.

Typically, most if not all the situations you described would be rare, if at all. Because to take an objective, a unit has to be within 3″, and to do that it must move. Therefore, after its Advance or Run order, it claims the objective at the end of its activation. Provided there are no enemies about.

That being said, lets look at the situations you mentioned above. “If I give an Ambush order, does that count?” For an Ambush order, I would say it counts. However, doesn’t that mean it was already close enough to the objective in the first place? So wouldn’t it already have claimed it from the previous turn? But someone might say, “What if it was captured by the enemy?” Well, that couldn’t happen because to claim an objective no enemy can be near. However, if there was an enemy, but not anymore, then yes, it counts. Now this links to “If giving an Ambush order counts…does starting the game in Ambush count?” I would say, “Yes” because as mentioned earlier, Ambush is an activation. The unit didn’t move, sure, but it ended its activation within 3″.

Now what about “If I go Down for being shot at, does that count?” For this situation I would say “No” because going down is a reaction and not an activation. Basically, this just seems like common sense and reasonable thinking as there are no actual rules for this in the book.

[Hoff]

@Kar98k

Thanks for the response. I’m mostly thinking of situations where you have an infiltrating squad and an army rule that allows you to start in ambush. This appears to have the effect of giving you control of objectives before the game starts.

[Stuart Harrison]

“Now what about “If I go Down for being shot at, does that count?” For this situation I would say “No” because going down is a reaction and not an activation. Basically, this just seems like common sense and reasonable thinking as there are no actual rules for this in the book.”  I would say this is creating a distinction that doesn’t exist in the rules. As I read it, reactions are just opportunities for units to use their activation for that turn out of the normal sequence of drawing dice.

There is nothing to suggest that an order carried out without waiting for the normal draw of a dice is any less ‘an activation’ than an order carried out any other way. Down can be performed as a normal sequence action, why would it matter when it happened, as a result of a dice draw or as a reaction?  A recce unit can move as a result of it’s reaction, and ends with an Advance or Run order – do they not count as ‘an activation’ because it was a reaction?

[Kar98k]

“…an infiltrating squad and an army rule that allows you to start in ambush. This appears to have the effect of giving you control of objectives before the game starts.”

@Hoff – Yep, they can be sneaky that way.

“A recce unit can move as a result of it’s reaction, and ends with an Advance or Run order – do they not count as ‘an activation’ because it was a reaction?”

@Stuart – again, I would consider this a reaction and not an activation, but since these situations are so rare, I never loose sleep over it, and others shouldn’t either. Also, there are no clear-cut rules for this in the 3E book, so clubs might have different interpretations. I have never played or seen a game of BA3E where a Recce unit has used its “‘Escape’ Reaction” (p.150) to capture an objective. Has anymore?

Oh, and yes, if a unit receives Down as an activation and not as a result of a reaction, then sure, why not capture at the end of its activation. Should a unit reacting to being shot at be able to capture, well, that all depends on your gaming group’s interpretation. That being said, the group I play BA3E with has voted on this, but with things so unclear, sometimes these votes change easily. That being said, I will quote the rule book, “If the nominated target has not yet taken an action that turn the player can, if they wish, immediately order it Down. If the player decides to do so, pick an order die of the appropriate colour from the dice bag and place it next to the unit, showing it has gone Down.” (p.82, TARGET REACTS) The clause “immediately order it Down” sounds like an activation to me. Steve, are you reading this (wink).

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