Angle of impact

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  • #177413
    SteveT
    Participant

    Help again, sorry to bother you all with my rules questions. Hopefully others will benefit from your responses too.

    How do we know the angle of impact if a tank shoots another.  A current, for example, should perhaps hit the front or the side. Do we choose the best, and if so fo we choose the best angle for the shooter or defender?

    Thanks

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    #177417
    Nat
    Participant

    you hit the side you are in the arc of even if you cant see that side … see the rule book for concealment of vehicles where it talks about not being able to see the front of a tank but work out the shot V the front

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    #177424
    SteveT
    Participant

    Hmm but what if the arc covers 2 sides?

     

    Cheers

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    #177425
    Master Chief
    Participant

    I think while the firer’s line of sight might see 2 sides of the target, the firer’s gun barrel will only enter one arc of the target, unless the firer is so (un)lucky that the gun barrel lies exactly on the line that divides the front and side (or side and rear) arcs of the target. In which case I would use the “better” armour class … otherwise roll D2 to determine which side the shell hits 😊

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    #178107
    Steeljackal
    Participant

    The attacker can see the target’s front and side, and can hit one of them.

    The ruls, however, says that you must not see what the attacker sees, but in which arc (defender’s arc) the attacker is located, in this case he is in the front defender’s arc and therefore the front armor value is applied.

    The reason behind this: even if the attacker’s hits the target’s flank, it would be too angled (more armor to penetrate or the bullet bounces more easily), and therefore it is correct to apply a malus to the penetration.

     

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    #178110
    Steeljackal
    Participant

    You use fire vehicle’s fire arc for 2 things:

    1- When you is the attacker, determine where you can fire and wich weapon can fire

    2- When you is the target, determine where they shoot to you, where the shot comes from

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    #178131
    Master Chief
    Participant

    Good illustration diagrams. The other question that arises is what if exactly 50% of the firer lies in the front arc and 50% in the side arc. For example the line separating the target’s front and side arcs cuts exactly long the diagonal of the shooting vehicle.

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    #178132
    Steeljackal
    Participant

    The only problem is precisely if the axis of the cannon barrel is on the separation line of two arcs of fire. But as Masterchief has already written, in similar cases (such as when it is too far to say whether or not there is cover) the regulation suggests that in case of uncertainty to roll a dice: in this case 50% is front arc 50% is lateral arch

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    #178140
    Kar98k
    Participant

    The only problem is precisely if the axis of the cannon barrel is on the separation line of two arcs of fire.

    Good question, but seriously, how often (if ever) does this really happen? I have never seen this come up in our club’s games.

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    #178144
    Master Chief
    Participant

    Good question, but seriously, how often (if ever) does this really happen? I have never seen this come up in our club’s games.

    That’s probably true but it can still happen. One could also ask how often do you see a Chaffee take out a King Tiger from the front? I have only seen it happen once so far, and we nicknamed that tank “Lucky Chaffee” 😊

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    #178152
    Nat
    Participant

    The other approach is just to play a KV1… then it doesnt matter what arc they are in, your still DV10+ :p

     

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    #178411
    Mark Prichard
    Participant

    We use a 45 degree template and a laser line to determine what arc a player is shooting.  You place the template under the vehicles being shot and then use the laser pointer to determine where it hits.  It is is on the side, it is a side shot.   If it is only on the front its a front shot.  It has made games alot less argumentative on the subject.

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    #178415
    Steeljackal
    Participant

    We use this simple but useful template and laser like Mark

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    #178495
    Master Chief
    Participant

    Good idea to use a template. I did a quick search and found these on the market. They come in different sizes, to fit different sized vehicles.

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    #178497
    Tim Haslam
    Participant

    Hummm, I can see how that helps.

    However, for some players it would only shift the argument to “where do you place the template”!

    The front of some armour isn’t clearly defined in most cases.

    I prefer to play where we just agree if it looks like a side impact, and if not roll a dice.
    saying that, I do have a laser and a template in my army transport box, lol!

    Just reading this thread makes me aware of how sometimes you can get a bit too wrapped up in the rules.

    Go in peace brothers (and sisters oh! And gender neautrals)

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