Defeating the Japanese?

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  • #188206
    richard zamudio
    Participant

    A local player runs a Japanese force of 5 Bamboo Spearmen squads( 15 figures each) It is very difficult to kill enough men in 6 turns! Any suggestions as to how to defeat this horde of manpower (short of nukes!)(: In all seriousness, now that the fanatics no longer take morale checks when fired at by flamethrowers, what is one to do?

    #188207
    Nanashi
    Participant

    Tanks. Spearmen can’t do anything to armor (though spearmen are typically paired with lunge mines and/or artillery who can) and a “Dakka Stuart” (usable by US and anyone with lend lease) as well as early Panzer 3 (usable by Germany and a few of the more minor axis) can make a lot of shots against big groups of infantry.

    Artillery is another option. Spearmen can only charge so far, but bigger howitzers will hit from almost anywhere and (with the spotter) can use cover. With 15 figure they’ll likely start to form clumps vulnerable to HE.

    #188208
    Nat
    Participant

    following up from @Nanashi’s points

    Mess his plans up…..
    Cheep forward deploying units to run behind his spearmen – the Banzai rule says towards the closest visable unit (yes that includes the tank that they cant hurt & inexperienced artillery spotters :p) & spearmen have a 360 arc of sight.  So if he wants them to move forward he needs to take the normal order checks.  Which leads to  template weapons, and high PINs…. yes fanatic means they wont break if PINs = Ld, but they wont be able to do anything except go down or Banzai move (see point about running people behind him)

    And in seriousness – Ignore that FAQ flamethrower entry!… personally I’d allow fanatics to test as if stuborn against flamethrowers but thats it, as its  game breaking (as you’re finding out :() to allow them to ignore the panic check (but then I have a house rules on flamethrowers regarding their fuel check as well

    #188212
    richard zamudio
    Participant

    This may seem an obtuse question, but where does it say that bamboo spearmen cannot attack tanks?My opponent is a stickler for rules and he will certainly need to be proven otherwise! Aside from this, all of the suggestions have been very helpful.

    #188216
    Stuart Harrison
    Participant

    They don’t have any such rule that I’m aware of, they even have access to AT grenades.

     

    #188217
    Nat
    Participant

    Can spearman attack a tank.

    Yes, if they banzai they auto pass their tank fear check… however once they get there, can they hurt it?…

    They need to hit (1 dice each..and if you moved* they need 6s, otherwise 4s – unless you run then it’s impossible to hit) each hit is +1 pen but limited to a single superficial hit on the tank at best…and it’s against front armour

    So 15 guys attacking a medium tank…7 hits, so a 2+ for a superficial…if you’d advanced then 2 hits = no damage roll possible

     

    *Although remember that this is off the order die, so if you have down for any reason it’s a 4+ to hit.

     

     

    #188220
    SteveT
    Participant

    I play Japanese a lot and the thing I fear is the enemy keeping at range, especially artillery/mortars and tanks – suicide bombers can’t do much if the target is far away.  Depends on the scenario, if high terrain or it’s one of those where you both rush in, chances are I am going to come off better, but any relatively open table really makes it hard to play to the Japanese army strengths.

    #188223
    GeneralJimbo81
    Participant

    SAS jeeps could be useful. Fast so you can zip em round behind preventing the Banzai. Also bedecked with MGs for mowing down infantry. You can even take them as Inexperanced (not sure quite why that is as SAS are generally even in ww2 cosidered to be one of the most elite forces in the world).

    You can do similar with transport Uni Carriers too (and can have as many as you can afford). Put a cheap unit, your obs (after he’s or before he drops his 1 shot) in it. It can the benefit from the Pintle LMG upgrade and doesn’t disappear in a puff of smoke the moment an enemy is nearest model. I’ve actually toyed with the idea of using spotters purely as LMG gunners / closest enemy logic eliminators. They can fire the LMG but as its the Carriers activation not their parent artillery pieces don’t prevent that firing. The artillery will need to see though as they can’t spot from the Carrier. This is just an idea I had though as I’ve not actually tried it yet.

    #188229
    Stuart Harrison
    Participant

    Spotters can’t fire weapons – from the FAQ:

    “Can a medic or an artillery/mortar spotter fire the weapons of a
    vehicle they are being transported in?
    It’s the passengers doing the firing, and therefore medic
    units, because they ‘cannot fire any weapons’, cannot fire a
    transport’s weaponry.
    Spotters similarly cannot fire weapons and cannot spot while
    in the transport (extending to them the rules for HQs, which
    cannot use their special rules while transported)”

    #188232
    GeneralJimbo81
    Participant

    Thanks for pointing that out I’d missed it on the FAQ.

    Is bit odd though as i thought spotters can shoot the weapons they’re armed with so long as their artillery unit doesn’t.

    Also does this mean that unarmed troops (i.e. unarmed Home Guard or say Japanese Spear fighters) can’t fire such a weapon on a transport as they can’t shoot (by virue of not having any ranged arms)?

     

    #188233
    Nat
    Participant

    Erm, well… spotters have a specific rule that says they cant “assault or fire against enemy units”

    Its that rule that stops them mannaing a transports weapons.

    Lets see…  Soviet Shtrafbat squad’s unarmed rule says they cant shoot….so that would transfer to a transport as well… However you normally have some models armed in those squads so they would be man the transports weapons.  So if the squad only contained unarmed models (a lot of exceptionals!) then I’d say they wouldnt be able to use a transports weapons, but so long as 1 model is armed then yes they could. – hope that makes sense.

    • This reply was modified 2 months ago by Nat.
    • This reply was modified 2 months ago by Nat.
    #188256
    Alan Tibbetts
    Participant

    Spearmen should do fine against any open topped armor without recce. Personally, I think they should have a suicidal charge rule, making them -1 to kill (inexperienced die on a 2+).

    #188268
    GeneralJimbo81
    Participant

    Was looking at the French rules last night and reallised they are potentially even more nuts than Japanese.
    As such you could always give him a dose of his own medicine as it were and build a French force. Take 3x Full 12 man (with the extra 4pt man with a pistol) inexperianced infantry and get another 12 man unit for free. Take a further 2 full 12 man units. Thats a total of 72 infantry plays his 75 spear fighters. If you take those last 2 units as Inexperianced as well you’ve only paid 30 more points for them compared to him but even if you take them regularyour only just over 100pts more and (nearly all) your men have rifles. True you’ll prob want to get some LMG or VB upgrades as well.
    You can also have a free Med Howitzer and take an additional Howitzer as well and a mortar. All this can still come in at under 500pt (No upgrades and a Med & light How and Inex Mortar). Thats a lot of men and artillery to hit those spear fighters. However lets assume you want some bigger guns and take some upgrades that can still come in at under 700pt which depending on your battle size gives you enough for Command and a few other bits.

    I’m not saying this is perhaps “in the spirit” but it could make a point.

     

    #188284
    richard zamudio
    Participant

    Not a bad idea! As hardly anyone around here plays the French (for a variety of reasons),this could come as a rather unpleasant surprise!

    #188285
    Donald Linn
    Participant

    Maybe take Gurkhas?

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