Shooting and Cover

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  • #187418
    Charles
    Participant

    I just noticed in the Cover section on page 57 in the rules that if 50% of the shooting figures fire through cover, then all shots from that squad take that modifier. We had been calculating this by figure. For example, if a 10 man squad fired, then those that had an open shot didn’t take the cover modifier. I also notice they use the word shooter, as in not the entire squad, only those shooting. My question then becomes can I not shoot everyone who has line of sight and range? For example, in my 10 man squad, 4 are shooting through the open at the enemy and 6 are shooting over a stone wall. The rule seems to say all shots will now take a -2 hard cover modifier as more than 50% are firing over the wall. Can I choose not to shoot 2 over the wall and only shoot 8 figures? Now 50% of the shooters are firing through the open and 50% over the wall and I don’t take the modifier? Is there a rule that says all eligible shooters must shoot?

    #187423
    Nat
    Participant

    No, however you do say who’s going to shoot before measuring (and that would include working out if people are in cover from the shooter as it’s work out range & cover)…..

     

    Thus rule is used with flamethrowers that are obviously out of range so you don’t have to do a fuel check

    • This reply was modified 4 months, 1 week ago by Nat.
    #187425
    Stuart Harrison
    Participant

    Cover is worked out based on the whole unit, not model by model.  Whether each model can shoot(line of sight to an enemy model, range to nearest visible enemy model, line of fire doesn’t pass too close to friendly models not from same unit) is all worked out model by model.  I suspect the way they chose to do cover is related to the fact you can remove casualties from anywhere in the unit, including those out of sight.

     

    #187427
    Charles
    Participant

    This would make a difference only when the target is in the open. If 50% of the target is in cover, then what I’m asking is irrelevant.

    Here’s what recently happened. A 5 man enemy infantry squad was completely in the open but had gone down. My US 9 man infantry squad armed with 8 rifles and a BAR moved up to a stone wall in short range with 1 over the wall, 2 at it, and 6 more than an inch away behind it. My opponent said page 57 means that since more than 50% of my unit was firing with hard cover in the way, my shot went from hitting on 5’s to hitting on 7’s. When I read the rule after the game was over, it clearly said shooters, not figures in the squad. My question is could I have held the fire of 3 in the back. That would now have 50% of the shooters not shooting over cover. I’d rather roll 7 dice needing 5’s (BAR included) than 10 dice needing 7’s. I see where the rules say all fire at the same target, but not that all must fire.

    Another common thing that happens in our game is that a 10 man squad with lmg moves onto the table and all but the lmg go behind a building because they’d be out of range anyway, but the lmg is left hanging out to fire and the squad still qualifies for hard cover if shot at. The single lmg has clear line of sight out to 36″ to a squad in the open and fires with no cover modifier, only moved and long range. According to this rule if I have to count the entire squad, that lmg should now take a -2 hard cover modifier if we’re counting the whole squad and not just the shooters as the rule states. If the answer is that I don’t count the figures that can’t actually shoot, then the rule doesn’t apply to the whole squad and my question is can I make some unable to shoot by just not wanting to shoot them as I don’t see anything that says you have to shoot every figure that has a shot.

    #187428
    Stuart Harrison
    Participant

    You don’t have the option of withholding fire with individual figures to fudge the odds – p51, Shooting, Measure Range and Open Fire, third para:
    “Every model that can draw a line of fire to at least one enemy model in the target unit shoots at the nominated target.  Note that players cannot hold back a unit’s fire – when a unit fires, every model that can shoot must shoot.”

    #187431
    Charles
    Participant

    Thanks. That’s what I was looking for.

    #187441
    Steeljackal
    Participant

    An example on pic uploaded…

    So if you put an infantry squad behind a building and leave a LMG in open ground, your unit benefit from cover but LMG can shot without cover  modifier (obviously unless there are other obstacles to the firing line)

    • This reply was modified 4 months, 1 week ago by Steeljackal.
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    #187451
    Charles
    Participant

    Yes, at least that’s the way I read it and how we play it locally. Page 57 says shooters, not figures. The figures behind the building can’t shoot and aren’t shooters because they don’t have line of sight. Cover is worked out as to how it affects the eligible shooters and assuming the enemy squad is not in any cover. When the squad in the open shoots back, the target squad is more than 50% behind a building and gets cover.

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