HE against building

Home Forums Historical Bolt Action HE against building

Viewing 8 posts - 1 through 8 (of 8 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #189081
    Steiner
    Participant

    Dear Comrades,

    Let me see is I am doing this process well with an example …

    It is first turn. German player deploys a sniper team inside a building on the second floor. Then, the British player deploys a Cromwell tank.

    The Cromwell tank advances and fires its main gun with HE (2″) and its machine gun to a second floor of a building where a German sniper hides.

    To see if it hits, measure distance = 23 inches. The medium AT gun is 60 inches, so it is short range. The only penalty is moving, so a +4 to hit. Roll and gets a 5. HIT!

    Now the number of hits: the sniper cannot get DOWN because it was deployed there in the first turn of the game. Roll a dice D6 (2″) to see the number of hits. Roll and gets a 4.

    Finally roll for damage, German sniper is a veteran team of two. This means +5 (no extra protection for HE in buildings) but penetration is +2. This reduces the +5 to +3. Roll the 4 dice and gets: 2, 3, 4, 6. The whole sniper team is wiped out! It is now unnecessary to fire the machine gun.

    Is this example correct?

    • This topic was modified 1 year ago by Steiner.
    #189083
    Stuart Harrison
    Participant

    The ‘to hit’ part of the example is incorrect.

    The only ‘to hit’ modifier you ignore is cover, all other modifiers such as small team, down etc still apply as per the errata.

    This part is also incorrect – “Now the number of hits: the sniper cannot get DOWN because it was deployed there in the first turn of the game. Roll a dice D6 (2″) to see the number of hits. Roll and gets a 4.”

    Just stating for clarity on this one: ” It is now unnecessary to fire the machine gun.” While you don’t need to waste time rolling the dice, as you declared this weapon firing it still fires – you can’t re-declare it at another target, for example. If it was a one shot weapon it would be expended, if it could run out of ammo (such as a flamethrower) you’d have to test for that.

    Deployment, including snipers, spotters, and observers, happens before the game starts as part of setup. The sniper can go down as normal if he hasn’t received an order yet this turn. If he has moved there, as opposed to deployed there, he will have an order – that will be what prevents him going down.

    #189084
    Steiner
    Participant

    Thanks for the answer. 🙂

    I see what you mean. On page 124-5 in the rulebook it says what you just pointed out, ignore only the cover penalty hits.

    Now, I have another question about the DOWN part.

    In normal situation when a player declares a fire order then the other players can choose DOWN BEFORE the roll for HIT.

    But in the HE against buildings, ” it can declare it is going down before you roll to determine how many hits are caused …”.

    So, it seems that you can call down in two different moments???

    1 Before rolling to HIT the building, in this case the down modifier applies.

    2. The player rolls to hit the building, if it hits it then the other player says DOWN. So, in other words, you only choose DOWN if the HE hits the building and if it misses you can spare the DOWN order. Right?

    In short, the defender player can say DOWN before rolling to HIT. In my example the Cromwell tank +3 (modifiers, -1 moved, -1 small unit , -2 down) = +7 This makes it very difficult to hit but the sniper cannot be activated later in the turn because it is down.

    Or, wait to see it the building is hit. … Cromwell +3 (modifiers, -1 moved  -1 small unit) = +5 This increases the probabilities of being hit but it give you the option of sparing the DOWN order until you see if the building is hit or not.

    a) If the Cromwell misses the shot, the snipe can be activated later.

    b) but if the Cromwell hits the building, now the sniper can decide to go DOWN to reduce the roll for number of hits or not going down and take the risk, so that if it survives, it can be activated later.

     

    • This reply was modified 1 year ago by Steiner.
    • This reply was modified 1 year ago by Steiner.
    • This reply was modified 1 year ago by Steiner.
    • This reply was modified 1 year ago by Steiner.
    #189089
    Stuart Harrison
    Participant

    Again, see the errata – that timing of deciding to go down has been brought in line with the actual HE rules, which state you must decide before rolling to hit:

    “Page 124-125, HE weapons against buildings.e second and
    third paragraph will be changed to read as follows:
    This means that when rolling to hit you ignore any to-hit penalties for cover.
    All other modifiers apply as normal – for example, Down in this case might
    represent the unit hiding in the building and if the enemy misses the shot,
    this might represent the them not having taken the shot at all, and instead
    still be searching for the target (and similarly a small team is more difficult
    to spot inside a building…).
    If you score a hit, this means that the shell has managed to find – or make
    – an opening. The unit inside that floor of the building suffers a number
    of hits equal to the ‘damage in buildings’ value in the HE chart for that
    shell (D3, D6, 2D6 or 3D6). If the unit is Down (units in buildings can react
    by going Down as normal when targeted by HE), the hits are halved as
    normal, rounding up. When hit by […]”

    #189090
    Stuart Harrison
    Participant

    Link to the Errata/FAQ on Warlord’s webstore:

    #189093
    Steiner
    Participant

    <p style=”text-align: center;”>Let see if I get the example right now.</p>
     

    In the set-up. German player deploys a sniper team inside a building on the second floor.

    Then in the first turn, the British player deploys a Cromwell tank. The Cromwell tank advances and fires its main gun with HE (2″) and its machine gun to a second floor of a building where a German sniper hides.

    To see if it hits, measure distance = 23 inches. The medium AT gun is 60 inches, so it is short range. The Snipe team goes DOWN.  Ignoring penalties for cover, the penalty is for moving, small team and down, so a double 6 to hit. Roll and gets a lucky 6 and the another 6. HIT!

    Now the number of hits: the sniper team is DOWN so half rounding up. Roll a dice D6 (2″) to see the number of hits. Roll and gets a 5. Half rounding up is 3.

    Finally roll for damage, German sniper is a veteran team of two. This means +5 (no extra protection for HE in buildings) but penetration is +2. This reduces the +5 to +3. Roll the 3 dice and gets: 2, 4, 6. The whole sniper team is wiped out! It is now unnecessary to fire the machine gun, which is considered like fired and cannot try another target this turn.

    Is this example correct now?

    • This reply was modified 1 year ago by Steiner.
    #189099
    Stuart Harrison
    Participant

    Sniper team is also a small unit, so you’re on 7+ to hit – requires a 6 followed by a 6.

    Other than that, looks correct.

    #189100
    Steiner
    Participant

    Thanks you very much Stuart. You’re very patient with me. I am struggling with the rules, but I am starting grab some complex issues. I make the changes in my example above so I can later copy and paste in my FAQ personal document. Thanks a lot 🙂

    • This reply was modified 1 year ago by Steiner.
Viewing 8 posts - 1 through 8 (of 8 total)
  • You must be logged in to reply to this topic.