The FG42 in Bolt Action, and how easy it is to fix the error.

Home Forums Historical Bolt Action The FG42 in Bolt Action, and how easy it is to fix the error.

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 18 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #191039
    Kar98k
    Participant

    It is clear that Warlord Game’s knowledge is somewhat lacking in some areas of weapons if we use their Bolt Action rules as an example. However, sometimes the simple things are the easiest to fix. If fact, we had brought this up back in the old days when the first edition of Bolt Action was still fresh and new, and the old Bolt Action forum was still around. However, when the old forum got a make-over, all the old posts went to dust. So, to basically repeat what we said then, but using third edition rules, here we go again:

    On page 98, simply correct the mistake:

    AUTOMATIC RIFLE
    This category is intended to cover weapons like the one-man
    FG42 automatic rifle used by the Germans, and the Browning
    Automatic Rifle (BAR) used by American infantry squads in lieu
    of a two-man light machine gun. The BAR was a weapon of World
    War I vintage originally designed to allow advancing infantry
    to give covering fire as they approached the enemy, while the
    FG42 was specifically developed for the Fallschirmjäger in 1942.

    On page 204, simply make accommodations for the FG42 as follows:

    Fallschirmjäger Squad
    Cost: Veteran Infantry 70pts
    Composition: 1 NCO and 4 men
    Weapons: Rifles
    Options:
    – Add up to 5 additional men with rifles at +14pts each
    – The NCO and up to 6 men can have submachine guns instead of rifles for +4pts each
    – The NCO and up to 9 men can have assault rifles (e.g. StG44) instead of rifles for +6pts each
    – Up to 2 men may have an FG42 automatic rifle instead of a rifle for +6pts each
    – Up to 2 men can have a light machine gun for +15pts – for each light machine gun included another man becomes the loader
    – Up to 4 men can have a panzerfaust in addition to other weapons for +15pts each
    – The squad can be given anti-tank grenades instead for +2pts per man
    Special Rules:
    – Stubborn
    – Tank hunters (if anti-tank grenades taken)

    That’s it! See, very easy to fix, and if this house rule gets used by all, then it sort of becomes standard.

    We have been using the FG42 as an automatic rifle in our games of Bolt Action since the very start, and frankly, we are still amazed that Warlord Games has not been enlightened yet. That being said, Bolt Action isn’t the only rule set to make this error. Some other rules get it wrong too, like V for Victory. Not to worry because this is an easy fix as you can see above. However, some rules do actually get it right the first time including a rule book called Battleground WW2 which was released over 15 years before Bolt Action.

    Since the FG42 (with just over 7,000 produced) was only used by the Fallschirmjäger, the overall error in game play is limited, but in most cases like in Bolt Action and V for Victory, it is a very easy fix the rules and correct this error.

    For those that still don’t think it is an automatic rifle, please read “Death from Above: The German FG42 Paratroop Rifle” by Thomas Dugelby and Blake Stevens before giving an uneducated response. Or, even watch that Forgotten Weapons episode where they do a side by side of the FG42 and BAR. Spoiler Alert, FG42 comes out on top, but both do the same thing – automatic rifle.

    #191045
    L.T. Russell
    Participant

    EXCELLENT post, Kar98k!  It’s too bad Warlord Games isn’t interested in cleaning up their product.  I’ve only been making this argument since Version 2.  It’s somewhat discouraging that you’ve been trying since Version 1.  I see the removal of comments from Warlord Games article as their unconcern for feedback from their customers.  I don’t see that as anything positive….

    #191065
    Michael
    Participant

    It didn’t have the same effective range so the assault rifle is probably the best fit.

    #191067
    L.T. Russell
    Participant

    Howdy Michael!  You’re basing your assertion on what?  Both the FG42 and the BAR utilize a full-length rifle cartridge.  This is the primary difference between assault rifles and automatic rifles.  Both weapons are magazine-fed and have bipods.  I don’t there’s any appreciable difference in “effective range” between weapons firing 7.92mm and .30-06….

     

    #191068
    Michael
    Participant

    <p style=”text-align: left;”>Tech data has the FG42 with an effective range of approx 300m and the BAR 600+yrds</p>

    #191072
    Kar98k
    Participant

    @Michael – Please do not depend on a single source, and if you do, please check out the best source available called, “Death from Above: The German FG42 Paratroop Rifle” by Thomas Dugelby and Blake Stevens.

    #191074
    Stuart Harrison
    Participant

    @Michael – also note your reference image for the FG42 doesn’t suggest the effective range is only 300m, it states that they weren’t able to get meaningful results beyond that range due to conditions on the day, then goes on to say ‘… although analysis of the following indicates that no critical deviations are anticipated at longer ranges.

    If you check other references, you will find the most commonly given effective range is 600m

    #191078
    Michael
    Participant

    That chart is taken from that book.

    #191082
    Kar98k
    Participant

    That chart is taken from that book.

    Which page?

    What we are saying is to avoid over-reliance on a single source of information, it is crucial to consult a variety of credible sources, then assemble the facts.

    Side Note: Let us look at how incorrect information was published about the performance of German aircraft used in The Great War (1914-18). After the war, the Allies had tested and evaluated German aircraft. If you read the reports, they don’t give German aircraft good reviews. There are multiple reasons for this including “National Pride”, but also, the German aircraft being tested were all worn-out and beat-up. The result was inaccurate data. Unfortunately, this data was used in a lot of books, and of course, has caused many errors.

    #191092
    Michael
    Participant

    The FG42 has a barrel 100mm shorter than a Kar 98 and 110mm shorter than a BAR. Do you think it may effect range? Also it kicked like a mule and was hard to control in full auto. Find a 8mm mauser with a 500mm barrel that shoots well over 400.The need for the fancy muzzle break/flash hider leads me to believe it also had alot of unburned powder at the muzzle

     

     

    #191093
    Michael
    Participant

    Page 20-21 split between

    #191094
    L.T. Russell
    Participant

    Still comes down to what kinda round does it fire.  Assault rifles fire a reduced-length rifle cartridge.  Automatic rifles fire a full-length rifle round….

     

    #191102
    Michael
    Participant

    If you want a fix it should be able to shoot like a rifle or assault at the players option. It was uncontrollable in full auto and doesn’t merit being an automatic rifle. (By capability nor doctrine).

    #191103
    Michael
    Participant

    Barrel length and control are more important than caliber

    Is an obrez a rifle?

    #191104
    Kar98k
    Participant

    Barrel length and control are more important than caliber

    Is an obrez a rifle?

    Now you are just being silly… or trolling. If not the latter, go here:

    https://www.forgottenweapons.com/2-gun-fg42-vs-bar-video/

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 18 total)
  • You must be logged in to reply to this topic.