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Worst General of All Time

Great battles, army histories, military equipment – you know the drill, soldier!
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Re: Worst General of All Time

Postby Cubster » Wed May 16, 2012 12:19 pm

Eumerin wrote:Of all the various men who ended up in command of the Army of the Potomac, I would say that the worst was probably Hooker.


Interesting little bit of trivia about Hooker. He got his nickname of 'Fighting Joe Hooker' completely by accident, due to nothing more significant than a missing comma. A newspaper was reporting details of the war and ran a headline that should have read 'Fighting, Joe Hooker', but instead came out as 'Fighting Joe Hooker'. I wonder how often such innocent things as inappropriate nicknames have caught the imagination of others and wrongly pushed people into command they should never have had.
"You're a big man, but you're in bad shape. With me, it's a full time job." – Lt. Bromhead to Prince Dabulamanzi before the Battle of Rorke's Drift.
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Re: Worst General of All Time

Postby NurgleHH » Wed May 16, 2012 12:20 pm

In my opion this question is a problem. Worst all his career or in one battle? See for example Napoleon. In Waterloo he was worst, but all time viewed a brilliant tacticman. Or even Haig, he ended the great war in 1918, and not in 1919 or 1920 like the french and the british goverment expected. But his prize was to high.
When you see one battle I think Custer and the roman general loosing his whole legion in germany is a winner for "WGOAT", when you see the whole career I think Hitler (not really general, but military leader) and Sadaam are the winners.
The prize for worst tactical plans go to Schliefenberg with his plan for the great war and the american militaries for the vietnam war (even a military desaster).

But the question is not a good one, I think...
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Re: Worst General of All Time

Postby gamester » Wed May 16, 2012 12:53 pm

my vote goes to paullus and varro (the roman comanders who lost the battle of cannae)
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Re: Worst General of All Time

Postby Eumerin » Wed May 16, 2012 5:59 pm

Cubster wrote:
Eumerin wrote:Of all the various men who ended up in command of the Army of the Potomac, I would say that the worst was probably Hooker.


Interesting little bit of trivia about Hooker. He got his nickname of 'Fighting Joe Hooker' completely by accident, due to nothing more significant than a missing comma. A newspaper was reporting details of the war and ran a headline that should have read 'Fighting, Joe Hooker', but instead came out as 'Fighting Joe Hooker'. I wonder how often such innocent things as inappropriate nicknames have caught the imagination of others and wrongly pushed people into command they should never have had.


Well...

The man was certainly aggressive on the battlefield - aside from his freeze up at Chancellorsville - so his attitude probably helped the name stick. And to the best of my knowledge there was nothing in his prior conduct that would have hinted at his disasterous performance at Chancellorsville. So it's hard to tell whether or not he "wrongly" ended up in the position as commander of the Army of the Potomac. Given Lincoln's situation (McClellan and then Burnside), Hooker seems to have been a reasonable choice. And Hooker seems to have done competently enough afterwards as a corps commander in the West.

The problem for Hooker, and the bit that will forever affect his reputation, is the one battle where he was the person ultimately responsible.
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Re: Worst General of All Time

Postby Comte Michel » Wed May 16, 2012 11:05 pm

Hooker is also (allegedly) responsible for inspiring the quote in answer to the question, "Who are all these women wandering around the camp?" - "Oh, those are Hooker's."

Hence the present day US nomenclature for ladies of negotiable virtue.

Has nobody mentioned the "unfortunate" Austrian General Mack - who basically sat and watched the entrire French army quite literally run rings round him at Ulm?

My money is still on Haig though, pointlessly squandering so many lives.
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Re: Worst General of All Time

Postby Eumerin » Wed May 16, 2012 11:34 pm

Comte Michel wrote:Hooker is also (allegedly) responsible for inspiring the quote in answer to the question, "Who are all these women wandering around the camp?" - "Oh, those are Hooker's."

Hence the present day US nomenclature for ladies of negotiable virtue.


Sadly, while a fun story, it's probably false, as Wikipedia states that the word can be found used in that context as far back as 1845.
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Re: Worst General of All Time

Postby Panzermike » Fri May 18, 2012 11:01 am

For me ....Zhukov.

Anyone can win a battle when you have an endless supply of tanks and men. Not a General but a butcher of his men.
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Re: Worst General of All Time

Postby Humbugged » Fri May 18, 2012 7:40 pm

I'd heard that the origin of the slang term for ladies of negotiable affection came from an area of New York populated by said ladies known as "The Hook." I may have imagined that though...
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Re: Worst General of All Time

Postby Comte Michel » Fri May 18, 2012 10:51 pm

Eumerin wrote:Sadly, while a fun story, it's probably false, as Wikipedia states that the word can be found used in that context as far back as 1845.


Bah, why are all the best stories false? Just like Roger the Cabin Boy in Captain Pugwash.

I wish it to be noted that I did say 'allegedly'. :P

I should also state for the record that Wikipedia is no guarantee of factual accuracy.
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Re: Worst General of All Time

Postby Cubster » Fri May 18, 2012 10:57 pm

Another example of that is, sadly, Catherine the Great didn't die by having a horse lowered onto her, during a boring afternoon when she decided to try something new. She apparently popped it by a stroke [insert gag here].
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