Cat amongst the pigeons - forming hedgehog!

[jazbo]

I know most people are at salute, but I'm not so I have been flicking through the P&S rules.

Forming hedgehog will undoubtedly cause more discussion than any other point.

My puzzlement is that you roll against you brigadiers command rating to see if a unit forms hedeghog with a pikeblock within 6". This seems wrong to me. It means you need to roll twice for a standard regiment to protect itself. It also means well drilled troops are actually rolling against a different rating, which is unrelated to their ability to react on the battlfield.

My preference would have been a simple roll a D6 per Regiment (ie, pike unit and 2 shot units) and if you roll 3+ you form, 2+ if elite, 4+ if shaken/disordered. One roll that is all about the unit, not the leader.

I do appreciate the large time period, and my thinking is more ECW/later 30YW, but it does seem a it odd to me.

[soldieroftheline]

I need to read it again, but I think you only have to dice if forming hedgehog as a charge reaction. You can do it as a formation change before getting charged if you want.

[soldieroftheline]

Plus the rules are a "toolbox" and all that so you could change it if you want to, butI'd want to try the rules as written first before tinkering.

Mods do you want to move this thread to the new forum?

Rob

[jazbo]

Well of course mr soldieroftheline who I don't know at all. But certain people might see seperate pike and shot units, and refuse to play at all !

[soldieroftheline]

Well he bought a copy as well so we'll have to see!!

[red]

If they want to adopt an immobile formation with negligible firepower that grants +1 to shooting at it, let them and bring all guns to bear!

[sane max]

The problem I have with hedgehog is that you can't do it if the pike are in combat.

So if you want to stop them forming hedgehog, charge the pike first..... (Yes, I know it's an ungentlemanly way to deliberately interpret the rules that way, but rules should only be 'interpreted' so far.... you don't see a chess player go 'Knight to King 4 - and that's checkmate' and the other guy saying 'I don't think you should... it's ungentlemanly of you')
Pat

[mikeland]

The problem I have with hedgehog is that you can't do it if the pike are in combat.

So if you want to stop them forming hedgehog, charge the pike first..... (Yes, I know it's an ungentlemanly way to deliberately interpret the rules that way, but rules should only be 'interpreted' so far.... you don't see a chess player go 'Knight to King 4 - and that's checkmate' and the other guy saying 'I don't think you should... it's ungentlemanly of you')
Pat

But if you charge the pike first they still have the chance to form Hedgehog as a charge reaction (Unless they are already engaged in combat with another unit). So if you charge the Pike first but isn't ungentlemanly, but it is a risk that they will form Hedgehog.

I imagine in the reality of battle the daring commander might attempt to take out a pike block by charging them before they have had chance to form up, or to charge them in the flank when the pike block is engaged.

[red]

No they don't, it's the Shotte sleeves that have the option to form hedgehog, first sentence 2nd column page 65.
The pike simply have hedgehog imposed upon them.

[Jammers]

No they don't, it's the Shotte sleeves that have the option to form hedgehog, first sentence 2nd column page 65.
The pike simply have hedgehog imposed upon them.

Agreed - "non-pike armed troops that are charged .."

It will be a simple thing to charge the pike first .. then wipe out the shotte