Legionary Transfers Questions

[wargame_insomniac]

Hi

I have just started to paint some WG EIR. Wanting to speed paint a small force for HC so I can then take my time over doing Macedonian army. So after seeing the great results obtained by the likes of Dr Phil Hendry i am going to try the dip method. I bought one of each of the 3 Army Painter shades when they first came out. I used the Dark Tone on my LOTR Uruak-Hai and loved it. Will be trying Soft Tone on Macedonians, and so have decided to use Strong Tone on my Romans. Strong Tone looks as it will be best for large areas of armour and red tunics on Legionaries.

So have have assembled first box set of Legionaries, spray undercoated them (light coat of Army Painter Black followed by coat of Platemail spray), and started to block paint base colours. Next up is doing transfers and dip. I did have a couple of questions:

1) I have seen people paint the front of shields as red and other have painted them white. I will be using the transfers that come in the box (ie Legio V). Which is best base colour for shields? Red or white?

2) I have been advised to attach transfers before dipping. I have also been recomended to paint gloss varnish just on shield before applying transfers (to prevent "silvering"), and also another coat gloss varnish just on shield after applying transfer (to protect transfer before dipping)- i.e. gloss varnish 1, apply transfer, gloss varnish 2, dip (and then eventually Matt varnish at the end once fully painted). Would this be excessive?

3) Is there anywhere list of which Legions/Regiments that the various LBMS Legionary/Auxiliary Transfers represent? I know that the transfers in the Legionary Box Set are Legio V. Do we know what units any of the other transfers are?

Thanks

James

[Big Al]

Regarding painting the shields first, white is recommended or the tranfers will look too dark.

With regard to gloss varnish, I haven't heard of varnishing first, but that doesn't mean that you shouldn't do it. I know some use micro-sol which is a decal adhesive and Humbrol do something similar, but I don't know what that is like. As to varnishing over the transfer with gloss varnish, remember that the Army Painter dip is exactly that, a gloss varnish. That's why you have to finish with a matt varnish, to take away the gloss finish.

Can't help you with the last item, sorry.

[Alan Charlesworth]

A light base colour is better as you want the colours to be bright. Remember the Army Painter dulls down the colours so it is always best to have everything slightly brighter and lighter if you are using the dip method or you will have a dark and grungy looking figure.

If you apply decals straight to paint in an area where you can see the paint surrounding the decal after application you will be able to see that it is a decal not a paint job. That is because its reflective properties are different. This is most noticeable on say a tank where there is a lot of area surrounding the decal. With shields it is not so noticeable.

The purpose of varnishing before and after applying the decal is that it completely hides the different reflective qualities of the paint and decal. The fact that it is a decal becomes invisible.

The Army Painter is effectively varnish with some colour in it so I don't think you need to varnish on top of the decal and then add army painter. If you want your shield to look really clear then you might want to try strong tone on the figure and soft tone on the shield. Experiment to see what looks best to you.

Micro-Sol and other brands of decal softener are very useful when applying decals to surfaces that are not perfectly flat. If a surface is not flat it is often very difficult to get the decal to lay flat and the final appearance can be spoiled. Bosses can be a particular problem which can be solved using a decal softener.

Again, like Alex, I can't help with the last question. Perhaps an e-mail to LBMS?

[wargame_insomniac]

Thanks guys.

So white shields to help keep them bright. Will try the gloss varnish on shields before applying transfers to prevent "silvering".

The reason that I was thinking of a 2nd coat of gloss varnish after applying transfers but before dipping, was based on the advice of someone down local gaming club. I was nt sure what effect the dip would have on transfers and whether they would need protective gloss varnish beforehand. However he had nt used Army Painter dip much so I wanted to ask you guys who would have used it in practice. I will take you advice and skip that second gloss varnish.

Re transfers I was talking about the ones sold by WG. The reason I called them LBMS transfers was that wanted to distinguish them from the free transfers that come in WG Legionary Box Set. I figured that if WG had asked LBMS to design some Legionary and Auxiliary transfers, then WG would have an idea as to what units they represented. Can anyone from Warlord Games help please?

i.e. do any of the Legionary and Auxiliary transfers sold by WG represent specific unit?

Thanks

James

[Phil]

Hi James,

One of the things we don't/can't know is what correspondence there is between units and shield designs. We presume, from a reference from the 2nd battle of Bedriacum (Cremona), that different units used different designs, because two men were able to pass themselves off as members of an enemy unit by carrying their shields. And that is about all the hard evidence we have...

There are plenty of shield designs in evidence - for example on Trajan's Column - but there's no way to associate these with particular units. So it's a case of 'do as you please'.

I hope this helps, and isn't too disappointing!

Of course, the good thing about this is that you can use any unit in your army to represent any real unit you like... Unlike in Napoleonics where, for example, it'd look a bit odd to use the unit you've painted up as the 1st Bn 34th Foot to represent 2nd Bn 55th Foot.

Cheers,
Phil

[wargame_insomniac]

Thanks Phil

It was more that i did nt want to use a specific shield transfer it it was associated with a specific unit that was different to the one I wanted to portray.

I have been reading up on Trajan's Dacian wars and the Marcomannic Wars of Marcus Aurelius. The free transfers in the WG Legionary Box set were for Legio V. From my reading it looks as if the Legio V Macedonica fought in both Dacian and Marcomannic Wars. A nice excuse to use the WG Veteran figures with greaves and manica. That gives me the options of having WG Dacian/Sarmatian/German figures as allies/opponents. Plus a nice geographical tie in to what will be my main army.

And I remember spending one lazy Saturday afternoon watching the epic The Fall of the Roman Empire. Not to mention a certain film starring Maximus Decimus Meridius.....

I just need to keep telling myself that this is only intended to be a small force to get a painted HC army on the table quickly, and not get too distracted from what will be my main army of Macedonians. The perils of gamers and shiny new toy syndrome!

Cheers

James

[Phil]

IIRC, the transfers in the Warlord legionary box are for 'Leg V VIC' - there wasn't a 'Legio V Victrix', so I suspect that it's actually 'Leg VI Vic' (with the 'I' missing) for Legio VI Victrix - which, of course, was one of the legions serving in Britannia.

But personally, I prefer to pick designs which don't have any numbers, so I'm not restricted in any way as to which unit the figures are from... One day mine might be Vespasian's II AUG, capturing hill-forts in Dorset, and the next they might be Leg VIIII HISP, marching off to an unknown (and fictional?) fate in Caledonia.

Cheers,
Phil

[Big Al]

This link explains something about "silvering"

http://www.3vwargames.co.uk/tips.htm

[wargame_insomniac]

IIRC, the transfers in the Warlord legionary box are for 'Leg V VIC' - there wasn't a 'Legio V Victrix', so I suspect that it's actually 'Leg VI Vic' (with the 'I' missing) for Legio VI Victrix - which, of course, was one of the legions serving in Britannia.

But personally, I prefer to pick designs which don't have any numbers, so I'm not restricted in any way as to which unit the figures are from... One day mine might be Vespasian's II AUG, capturing hill-forts in Dorset, and the next they might be Leg VIIII HISP, marching off to an unknown (and fictional?) fate in Caledonia.

Cheers,
Phil

Phil- that makes a lot of sense given that the HC rulebook features EIR vs Ancient Britons for army lists. That would make a lot of sense if it was supposed to be VI th Legion. I realise that Vic = Victrix.

In the end it is a good happenstance as it means that I can do them straight out of the box as Legio V Macedonica. I am more interested in having my Romans face off against Dacians and Marcomanni.

I just have to be strict with myself and restrain from buying those lovely Sarmatian Cataphracts. Well at least until i have finished the Romans.

Cheers

James

[wargame_insomniac]

This link explains something about "silvering"

http://www.3vwargames.co.uk/tips.htm

Al- that was really helpful- thanks very much

Cheers

James