Pike & Shotte Artillery

[Correus]

Since I started a topic on the new Demi-culverin let me branch out with this topic.

The Scots Frame Gun - was this used by the other armies as well? If so, I wonder if WG will be releasing Royalist and Parliamentarian gun crews for them?

The Mortar - was this something only used for sieges or would it be mixed in with the field artillery?

[mikeland]

Mortars were pretty much used for sieges if memory serves. Frame gun is generally asscociated with the Scottish, not sure why.... Will do some reading up.

[Correus]

Thanks Mikeland...I'll do some digging as well.

[mikeland]

Okay, really I should be in bed, not up reading ECW books, but I have just re read some of the Osprey ECW artillery book and page 16 briefly mentions scotish frame guns, and page 10 mentions mortars, and why they were ideal for sieges.

If you don't have it I can send you scans of the relevant pages.

[Correus]

Okay, really I should be in bed, not up reading ECW books,...

Really?! Why? It's only 8:02 here! And Gordon Ramsey is on the TV.

...Osprey ECW artillery book and page 16 briefly mentions scotish frame guns, and page 10 mentions mortars, and why they were ideal for sieges. If you don't have it I can send you scans of the relevant pages.

I have it in storage in the attic - I'll go dig it out. You know - I keep forgetting I have most of the Osprey ECW books!!

[BigMike]

The chief reason mortars were used mainly against fortifications (aside from their weight, shortage of ammunition and massive powder requirements ) Was the fact that they weren't very accurate and the gunner had to cut the fuse each time according to the conditions - too short and it might blow the gun, or airburst and cause little damage, too long and troops could put the fuse out. The big mortars also really needed to be dug in so tended to be used principally against fortifications - which couldn't move, are a big target and you could fire again with a different fuse.

In C17th England especially mortars tend to be effective against fortified targets as they caused more psychological harm than cannon.
Quote from one of the defenders of Lathom House in Lancashire.
"Little Ladies had the stomach to digest cannon, but the stoutest soldiers had no heart for this . . . the mortar piece had frightened 'em from meat and sleep."
Quoted in Marc Morris' book 'Castle', which is worth picking up.

As for the scots frame gun, i've never read an account of guns that light being used in the ECW - which is certainly not to say they weren't - my reading isn't that extensive and is confined to published histories. that said i have used a few of them to represent light artillery in Swedish service in the TYW as i like the WL model too much not to have one.

[cotton]

The Scots Covenanters fielded a huge array of artillery, ranging from huge siege pieces to tiny mobile "murderers" or frame guns. These are simple, small barrels attached to a sturdy wooden supporting frame, hence the name. Crewed by a just three or four men, they could be wheeled or indeed carried around on the battlefiled in a handy manner, firing a light cannon ball or as often we think, hail shot.

Warlord's gun comes complete with a sturdy mule to carry the gun and its supplies and three trained gunners.

Field this in all your Scottish armies of the period and keep your powder dry!

[lackey]

frame guns were more or less entirely scottish at this time, but the swedish armies of the 30 years war used them a fair bit. i may be wrong, but the few surviving peices of leather and frame guns are actually in sweden. thats not to say that english captains wouldnt have been able to procure one or two, but they would have been a rarity. as far as i know, there is no refference to them being made anywhere outside of scotland.
they would have also have been rare because they broke so often. during the siege of newburn, the scots pulled some of their frame-guns ontop of a church to fire from the tower, where it was commented that they had to be taken down and repaired as the frames split after 3 shots.

[Correus]

Thanks for all the info guys!

[davepark]

This forum gets me interests as it gives me additional information regarding artillery.