Black on black - washing ...

[clivethecelt]

Merci. D'ya think I should have started with a different base colour? Black just seemed to make sense ... as they were going to be black anyway; I use the leather brown for Celts, as it seems to work for their "earthier" colours. I ask as, although I've only the two of this miniature at present, Heresy do produce two other versions, which might come later if we get on well with the Witchfinder rules (I try to not have more than one mini of the same design), and then there's lots of other things in black to follow ... (i.e. She's a witc ...!)

[Biggus Dickus]

[quote="clivethecelt"]Thank you, gentlemen. I have some AP dip in the "dark" shade, BD, but didn't think it would work to "shade" black;

Are you sure Clive? I've heard it's the way to go!
I had to mention it.....perhaps I'm getting some major hang ups about it...but everytime someone on here asks for help with painting, I and others offer our best tips, and then they go...."I'll dip it in that case because it's quicker".....what we need in the modelling forum is one for painting tips and one for Dipping...so that i don't waste huge amounts of time listing various layers of paint and mixes when they are just going to use Ronseal on their figures instead. My dry sense of humour wasn't directed at you!

Anyway have to say, that in the cave where i live i hadn't heard of glazes!!!!! yes i know that is shocking!...so thanks for that cubster, i'm going to give that technique a go...Black is one of those tricky colours...and this sounds very cool. Your picture of the hat was very useful....and may i say very well done, I often sit and wonder how you achieve your results, and what I might not be doing that you are, clearly glazes are one of them.
Do you just thin paint with water or something else?

[mikeland]

...so that i don't waste huge amounts of time listing various layers of paint and mixes when they are just going to use Ronseal on their figures instead.

Ronseal!


ROTFL

I have honestly never tried the dip, and probably wont ever, though I have seen some pretty decent results using them. But point taken, if you are planing on dipping perhaps mention it in the OP.

As to Cubster it is my belief that he has some sort of dark arts miniaturization spell, that allows him to shrink himself down to 28mm size so he can paint the insane level of detail he manages... did you see the eyes on the Celtic standard bearer posted on another thread, not only had he managed to paint the eyes and they didn't look like someone on speed, but they have direction of gaze!!!!

viewtopic.php?f=15&t=4365

[Cubster]

Anyway have to say, that in the cave where i live i hadn't heard of glazes!!!!! yes i know that is shocking!...so thanks for that cubster, i'm going to give that technique a go...

I'll be honest, I was doing it without knowing it was called glazing. It's really just layering with thin paint. If you use a glazing agent I've found that to be useful if you're looking to do very subtle colouring effects (ie. the blueing on a steel blade, NMM light effects, highlights on a silk cloak, that sort of malarkey) because if you just add a lot of water to dilute the colour right down, it will just start to form droplets on the model instead of taking to the surface smoothly and evenly.

I really thought glazing agents and retarding agents would be pointless fluff I'd never use, but they've both got plenty of outings since I started using them.

[Cubster]

As to Cubster it is my belief that he has some sort of dark arts miniaturization spell, that allows him to shrink himself down to 28mm size so he can paint the insane level of detail he manages... did you see the eyes on the Celtic standard bearer posted on another thread, not only had he managed to paint the eyes and they didn't look like someone on speed, but they have direction of gaze!!!!

What you don't see is the amount of times I had to repaint them! My top tip for doing eyes (other than getting a tiny brush and going slow) is, if you're right handed like me, to paint the right eye of the model first. When I hold the model in my left hand, the brush in my right, it is a little awkward to get the brush across the bridge of the model's nose to plop the eye in. Thus if I do that one first, it's easier to line up the direction of the other eye to match it, rather than t'other way round.

Did I tell you the stupid level I went to with the 'Big Wullie' eyes? I did a dark iris rim, a light iris inner, black pupil and light spot. It was a while back and I'm not sure I lined them up properly and I certainly didn't put the light dots in the right place ... you live and learn, At the end my own eyes were bleeding and frankly I couldn't see an appreciable improvement from all the stages. Oh well, I know they're in there.

[Biggus Dickus]

thanks for that Cubster, I'll go off and get some glazing agents before i give this technique a try...when i make my own washes there is a point at which they seperate into water and blobs of paint....so that would seem to be the reason.

Cubster....the eyes, well...you've told us how you do it but it's just supernatural!!! i don't have a brush thin enough or a hand steady enough with or without reading glasses

@Mikeland, have to say i agree with you, i have seen some nice results with dips...but to be fair those results are really down to painting rather than dipping.... if anyone thinks the dip is responsible I'll get my troll pictures out again

[Cubster]

Actually that also shows a bit of glazing. I used some Chestnut Ink with a drop of red and thinned it down before applying it in coats to the cheeks and knotted brow. Looks a bit more lifelike than a plain old flesh colour all over. Too much like hard work for tabletop pieces, but for something that's going to be photographed it's worth a go.

[clivethecelt]

@BD - no need to apologise - though I feel as though I could be in a Fast Show sketch: "It's all gone black, black ..."
But you do something similar to what Cubster is describing with your flesh washes, don't you? I'm sure you've mentioned thinning and layering (=glazes?) to me in a past post. But the highlighting of that chap's hat is tremendous, and Wullie's complexion is ... very complex. And the eyes - I look at lots of eyes every day, but to put that detail onto a 28mm figurine is just stunning. That must be where AP dip comes in - brushing it on seems to get 'round that level of detail for tabletop level minis like mine, looking at the pics in the webstore. There's an article on painting Spartans by Bennett Blalock-Doane which sums it up for me - he goes through the painting process, then says, stop here if all you want is ... but if you want more, this is what you do ... but if ... and so on. I'd stop after about stage 2. It's nice to know that there are people at the top of the ladder in all hobbies or sports, to admire their skill and feel, yes, that's something I could aspire to - and even nicer when they're happy to share their knowledge. Not very commonplace in other disciplines.
Thanks all for this help, but I've some doggies to attend to. Now, where's the thinner ...

[carvel2]

I would echo Clive's comments on the amazing amount of support on this forum...it truely is inspirational.
As to the black....always fond of a bit of blue somewhere in that. Looking forward to your work in pictures and in reality Clive! I've been building a dark, dark wood

[stampedingviking]

Haven't seen it mentioned (but may have been distracted by Cubster's pictures), what about a base of GW's Charadon Granite with washes/glazes of black ink on top, then re-highlight the highlights with the Charadon again?